INTERVIEW WITH MARK WILLACY, AM PROGRAMME
Subjects: visit to Indonesia; asylum seekers.
E&OE……………………………………………………………………………………
PRIME MINISTER:
I’m anxious that we build further on the very positive tone involved in our meeting last August. I recognise some of the past difficulties but you don’t dwell on the past. You move on. I understand the enormous internal challenges that Mrs Megawati’s administration has and even as we meet there’ll be these enormous floods and I feel very sorry for the impact it’s had on the people particularly in and around Jakarta. But it’s the whole gamut of the relationship that’ll be under discussion.
WILLACY:
Well in terms of moving on is the issue of asylum seekers something that you do want to broach with President Megawati?
PRIME MINISTER:
I’m quite certain that that issue will come up in the discussions but the solution to that problem has never been one entirely within the hands of just Indonesia and Australia. It is a regional issue. That is why Australia and Indonesia together are chairing the regional meeting in Bali later this month which will be attended by a large number of countries. You can’t solve that problem without the involvement of the regional community.
WILLACY:
Well Opposition Leader Simon Crean would like to see some movement in relation to some sort of bilateral agreement with Indonesia on the issue of people smuggling. We’ve seen a lot of asylum seekers come from Indonesia. Is that a fair point? Do we need that one on one agreement with Indonesia?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well I think it’s a point. I mean you expect Opposition Leaders to say something to try and make a point.
WILLACY:
But has it got some validity?
PRIME MINISTER:
I think the most valid thing I can do is have a productive discussion with Mrs Megawati, understand the challenges she has, recognise that the asylum seeker issue, important though it is to Australia, is not the most important domestic or international issue facing her and her Government. I think we have to have a sense of perspective. What we regard as overwhelmingly important is not necessarily given the same precedence in another country. That doesn’t mean to say they are indifferent or they are unfriendly, it’s just a statement of the obvious.
WILLACY:
Well you’ve already run into a bit of strife ahead of today’s meetings. You’ve had the Chairman of the People’s Consultative Assembly – Amien Rais – saying he’s going to cancel his meeting with you. He says you’ve accused Indonesia of smuggling asylum seekers, that you support an independence referendum in West Papua. That’s obviously a disappointment for you is it that that meeting will not go ahead?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well more importantly those claims are completely untrue.
WILLACY:
So what do you think’s behind this cancellation by Amien Rais then? Is it domestic politics, is it some of those issues you’ve broached in terms of these internal struggles in Indonesia?
PRIME MINISTER:
I think that’s something that has to be pursued with him. I wouldn’t comment on domestic politics in Indonesia. But those allegations about Australia, attributed to him, are completely untrue, completely untrue.
WILLACY:
Issues like that, does that harm the relationship, does that set it back, does that make your job harder to go over to Indonesia and sell Australia as a friend, as an ally, as someone that Indonesia should do business with?
PRIME MINISTER:
No I don’t think so. I’m not particularly troubled by that. I think if you want to pursue that matter further it should be pursued in Indonesia.
WILLACY:
In terms of the floods will that hinder any of your appointments or your schedule?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well I certainly hope not. I feel very sorry for the impact it’s having on the Indonesian people and I hope that the visit goes ahead notwithstanding. I’m delighted that I’m still able to go and at the hospitality being given to me by Mrs Megawati and her Administration. I don’t think it will have any impact but if it does I’m sure you and others in the traveling media party will understand.
WILLACY:
What will be a measure of your success of this visit? You’ve spoken about the great rapport that you say exists between you and President Megawati. What will be the ultimate measure of success?
PRIME MINISTER:
Well I never set those benchmarks. They’re always set by people such as your good self and others. I mean you’ll make a judgment. From my point of view what is important is that we keep working at the relationship. We have realistic expectations, it’ll be based on mutual respect, it’ll be based on an understanding that although we are in this part of the world and we will share a future forever, we are very different societies. What we ought to do is concentrate on our commonalties, concentrate on the things where we agree and where we can work together and not get hung up about our differences. If you get hung up about differences you’ll never have a good relationship. That applies to people and it certainly applies to nations.
WILLACY:
On asylum seekers the United Nations’ High Commissioner for Refugees – Mary Robinson – would like to send her regional adviser to check out the Woomera operation. Will you let him in?
PRIME MINISTER:
That’s something we’ll discuss but the important point here is that we have fully complied with all of our UN obligations. UN committees have frequently asked questions and from time to time people and individuals have come to Australia. And we’ll look at it but I mean I’m not particularly bowled over by a request from Mary Robinson.
WILLACY:
But if you’ve complied with all UN obligations you’ve got nothing to hide. Why not let the person….?
PRIME MINISTER:
We will have a look at it but I’m not immediately bowled over by every request that comes from Mrs Robinson.